Can You Forgive Someone and Still Keep Your Distance?

Does forgiveness always mean reconciliation?

Many Christians have been taught that if they've truly forgiven someone, the relationship should immediately return to what it was before. But is that always the case?

In this episode, we unpack the difference between forgiveness and reconciliation, and why confusing the two can create real damage in relationships, churches, and leadership structures.

While reconciliation is always the ideal outcome, it requires more than forgiveness alone. Trust must be rebuilt. Repentance must be genuine. Change must be evident.

We also discuss the danger of restoring relationships or leadership positions too quickly, especially when real accountability and transformation have not taken place.

Check us out!

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Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Like I'm not hanging out with you anymore when somebody's I'm not putting myself in situations that I know I shouldn't be putting myself in and forgive you I love you but I do need to separate myself there can't be reconciliation. We can't go back to the way things work.

SPEAKER_00 0:14

Right.

SPEAKER_01 0:15

Because a line has been crossed. Welcome back to Seriously to this podcast. And what are we talking about today, Julia?

SPEAKER_00 0:28

Um well, we were having a discussion off-camera as we do on the idea of whether forgiveness always means reconciliation. And I guess we want to kind of unpack that, probably figure it out as we go. Um when it does and when it doesn't, if it should always or if it shouldn't. So since I introduced a topic which is not my job, I'm passing it back on over to you.

SPEAKER_01 0:56

Oh, wonderful. So when I'm thinking, should it always mean reconciliation? I think it really just depends.

SPEAKER_00 1:12

I think the nice part of me wants to say, I hope it always ends in reconciliation. But the realist in me wants to say it doesn't always, right?

SPEAKER_01 1:26

No, of course not. I don't even think biblically that lines up either, but go ahead.

SPEAKER_00 1:31

Well, thinking about that word should, right? This is the grammarian in me, because words have meaning, in case you didn't know. The word should is really telling a lot. And I think that there are some people who have the mindset that forgiveness should always end in reconciliation. And I don't think so, because there are a lot of variables to consider, which is why it changes situation to situation on whether it should or or not. Forgiveness is something that the believer is called to do regardless.

SPEAKER_01 2:05

Right.

SPEAKER_00 2:05

It's not really up for negotiation, you know. And the reason for that, I'm probably gonna step on a little bit of toes when I say this. I hear people say that forgiveness is not for them, it's for you. I don't know that I necessarily agree with that. I think that forgiveness is our opportunity to be like our dad because he forgave us. And yes, was that forgiveness for us? Totally. But I think that the forgiveness can be both ways. Yes, you should learn something in it, but it's not just about, oh, I'm forgiving you so that I get something. That's a very selfish way to look at that. And I don't, I don't think that that's accurate. And I also think sometimes when you forgive someone, especially someone who's not asking for forgiveness, you might not get anything out of that, you know. Right. You you might be offering them grace for in a way that they don't appreciate. So we can't wrap our mind around forgiveness as being for us and not for them. Um, but sometimes that forgiveness does not come with um now we're back on good terms like we were, because that person has to also be on board with reconciliation. And sometimes people just cross lines. And once certain lines are crossed, for your well-being, for the well-being of people around you, or maybe even for their own learning, the time is not today to be going back to business as usual. In my mind, are there circumstances where, yeah, maybe, sure. But all the time, I think is a dangerous thing to say and to tell someone.

SPEAKER_01 3:43

I think being able to reconcile, though, be the kind of person that consistently does reconcile is such a strength to be able to be that person. Um, but you hit something that as soon as you asked was is should we always reconcile? There are some things that you just don't they're not rec what is it, reconcilable. Yes. Is that the word? Okay. There's some things that it just doesn't work like that. And I I use, I'm gonna use an example. Um if and I've used this example before, so don't be surprised. Okay. If you're dating someone and he's beaten the crap out of you, and you move on, you forgive him, there's probably not gonna be reconciliation there. Probably not, probably not. It just it just doesn't seem logical, you know. If someone harms your child and you forgive them, I don't see Michael reconciling with them. I just don't see it happening. Yeah, knowing him.

SPEAKER_00 4:42

I don't see you doing it either.

SPEAKER_01 4:43

Probably not. Uh, but what I'm saying is there are some things that it you don't reconcile. It it just doesn't, it doesn't make sense. Um, if you, you know, that's no different than when you're hanging out with people and they're you're in a bad environment and you move yours remove yourself from that. It's no different. Like I'm not hanging out with you anymore. We're not buddies, I'm not putting myself in situations that I know I shouldn't be putting myself in. I forgive you, I love you, but I do need to separate myself. Right. There can't be reconciliation. We can't go back to the way things were because a line has been crossed.

SPEAKER_00 5:22

And I I think there's also the assumption that it, but when when you say that we should reconcile, that the other person has owned up to their end of whatever went wrong, because I can go into a situation and tell you that I forgive you. You've wronged me in some way. And I'm forgiving you because that's what I'm called to do, also because I'm not gonna let that just weigh on me for the rest of my life. But it doesn't mean that you have realized that you need to be forgiven. What if the view that you have on whatever the situation is is that I wasn't wrong? How do you reconcile that because our view on something is still at odds? So you're making the assumption that both parties have come to the agreement that whatever was done was wrong and we're both moving forward. One person might only be moving forward, and I can't pull you along. I think one of the reasons why we try to say that is because Christians are told to be peacemakers, right? Right. And that's biblical. Um, blessed are the peacemakers. But I like to follow that up with this. When Jesus was sending the disciples out to preach, he told them to go out and look for a person of peace and um stay with that person. And wherever you are, um, release your peace. And if there is a person of peace there, your peace will remain. But if there's not, your peace will return to you and keep on going. There's got to be someone there to receive said peace. If it's not a peaceful situation, you can't force someone to come along. You might not be the one who's against reconciliation. Maybe it's them. But my point is that we're only responsible for us and what we do. So I can't force you to be of the same mindset that I'm in. I can't force you to forgive me for what my wrong may have been. Um, and I can't force you to see it in a different way. So reconciliation takes two people, not just one person. So there's that. But the second part of that is exactly what you said. Sometimes when you cross a line, you can't go back. I can love you and I should, but is it wise for me to put myself, my emotions, my family in danger for where I know you still are? That's crazy because now we're telling ourselves not to use the wisdom and discernment God has given us to be able to see where that person is at and navigate that situation appropriately.

SPEAKER_01 8:09

Right. I think in one thing I do want to say is that reconciliation, though, do you think there's a level of when you're not willing to reconcile, when you don't think you should? Maybe something, maybe I don't want to say anything's minor because everyone's different, but let's say in my brain it's minor, you have a disagreement, you're not on the same page with someone. You have an argument, things get heated, maybe say some things you probably shouldn't have said, and then you come, you apologize, forgiveness, and but you don't reconcile the relationship. You're not, you don't want to be friend. You don't do you think there's a level of unforgiveness in that? Like, hey, I'm saying I'm forgiving you. I'm gonna say that's so easy to say, I forgive you, Julia. I do. And then I see you next week at work, I see you next week at church, I see you next week wherever, and I'm going to treat you differently. The relationship's not going to be the same. I'm not going to treat you with the same maybe um care that I originally did. I'm not going to really try to invest in this relationship anymore. Is that a level of unforgiveness that's causing that not to be reconciled?

SPEAKER_00 9:19

I think it can be. But I think just like what we've been saying, it just depends on the situation. Because it could be unforgiveness. It could be that I've forgiven you verbally.

SPEAKER_01 9:28

To this extent.

SPEAKER_00 9:29

Right. Um, but I really haven't in my heart. I'm still hurt about whatever it was, and I'm allowing that to navigate the way that I navigate. Um, it could be. It could also be because we don't really handle awkward well. And like after we've had like a really heated or awkward conversation, we don't know how to like go back. Smooth it over, you know. And I think that happens just as much as the unforgiveness. Um, I've seen it, you know, ruin relationships because it's just like, man, this happened. Now I don't know how to talk to this person anymore. Well, you knew how to talk to them two weeks ago. Go back to that. Um, so I I think it can be unforgiveness. I think sometimes we lie and say that we're past things that we're not past.

SPEAKER_01 10:16

Right. Right.

SPEAKER_00 10:16

Um, but I think sometimes it can just be awkward. And and sometimes I think space might be required for a season. Your relationship might absolutely be reconcilable, but maybe you need three days to like really process through what has happened. I'm a processor. Three years. Three years is a lot. I mean, unless this person came and burned your house down, like three years.

SPEAKER_01 10:45

Oh, it's gonna take a little bit more than three years.

SPEAKER_00 10:48

But I mean, I think there could be a plethora of reasons why the relationship doesn't go back um to normal after you've forgiven each other. But you do have to ask yourself, and you can only ask yourself that question, have I really forgiven this person? Because if I have, then my love for them doesn't change.

SPEAKER_01 11:09

Right.

SPEAKER_00 11:10

If I haven't, it might. And if and if it's weird, I'm one of those kind of people I just like to call the thing the thing, be like, hey, so this is awkward. But I feel like we need to do this. I'm just that person. I I can be awkward and upfront about it and hope that you'll sit there with me in that awkward space. But if I love you and I want our relationship back, I'll do it.

SPEAKER_01 11:37

So it's funny that you say that because I'm kind of the same way when it comes to the awkwardness after something. I actually had this happen recently where when I walked in the room, me and the person made eye contact, and immediately I could tell in their body language in their face, it was just like, oh God, like what am I gonna do? That's what the look was, and I was like, okay, for a second there, I was like, I don't care, whatever. I'm you know, I'm gonna leave it alone because I could care less, you know. And then I thought, and I took a second and I was like, no, let's go fix this. Like, let's go sit down. And I'm not the one that's like gonna say, hey, this is weird. I'm just gonna start talking to you. Like, like normal. We're gonna just have, and I'm gonna make you feel comfortable. Um, so I think we're very similar in that sense. No need to make it weird. We're just gonna, you know, bulldoze our way through this. We're gonna talk, we're gonna talk, we're just gonna. And by the end of it, that individual was talking to me, laughing, acting like them themselves. But I noticed in that second, that first second, when they saw my face, it was like, oh God, where can I hide? Like, where's there somewhere I can go? Um, and it was one of those, hey, you know, people that you're close with. Hey, that's not a hello. What is that?

SPEAKER_00 12:49

Hey, the heck.

SPEAKER_01 12:51

Like, keep your chin to yourself.

SPEAKER_00 12:53

Because if you ever hit me with one of those, I'm calling you out immediately.

SPEAKER_01 12:56

You good?

SPEAKER_00 12:57

Yeah, like you got a problem. But and I'm glad that you're more of a professional than me because I would address it by saying, wow, this is really awkward. So maybe we should just fix this.

SPEAKER_01 13:10

Like, that's just how my brain is just like, oh, let's just start breaking this, talking through this. Like, let's just start talking. I'll I'll start making this less and less intimidating, and then eventually we'll be back to the foundation we need to be at, and we can just keep going.

SPEAKER_00 13:25

And that's why you have the job that you have. Yes. Because you're good at it. I am I'm not good at it. I'm really good for just being honest. Hey, so last week that conversation that we had kind of went left. I really didn't want it to go that way. I feel like we're not good. Can we talk about it? That's me.

SPEAKER_01 13:48

And I'm more like, for some reason your eyebrows keep looking at me crazy from across the room. You good? Everything all right.

SPEAKER_00 13:55

Yeah, but that's throwing hands, Madison. That's a different Madison.

SPEAKER_01 14:00

But anyways.

SPEAKER_00 14:01

But I I think also from a positional standpoint, like we've talked relationally, right? A lot. And um, I think that's where it happens the most. But sometimes when we're quick to forgive, um, not quick to forgive, you should always be quick to forgive. Sometimes when we're quick to move on, uh, without any real change or real repentance, really is the word, we can cause casualties that had we just taken a second, wouldn't have happened. So, what do I mean by that? If you have this idea that forgiveness should always mean reconciliation, what if the person that you are forgiving, as you should, is in a leadership position over a bunch of people and you've forgiven them for something that they did wrong, which you should do, but then you immediately put them back into that position. There's been no growth, no change, nothing. They may not even see that the thing that they were held accountable for was wrong. If you have that mindset, more people are about to get hurt.

SPEAKER_01 15:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:09

And so again, should you forgive them? Yes. Should reconciliation be on the table? Absolutely. But when we think, okay, everybody said I'm sorry, now let's move on, like it didn't just happen 10 minutes ago. I think that's dangerous. And I think as leaders, we have to be mindful of that.

SPEAKER_01 15:29

And I think there's a thing that happens, especially in the church, where we try to minimize everything. Everything was tiny, everything was small, like you're billowing things out of proportion. Like this is not huge, as big as it is. And when you do that, it makes it to where you're not giving people the opportunity to reconcile things because they have an issue. Maybe they have a a problem and they came to you about the problem, and they're they're giving you grace, they're giving you forgiveness, and you're, oh, they're being dramatic. Oh, they're this, they're that. Well, now I don't want to reconcile with you because you're clearly not on the same page.

SPEAKER_00 16:07

Right.

SPEAKER_01 16:08

Clearly, things that are not acceptable, you're minimizing them. That doesn't make me want to reconcile. That makes me want to say, okay, I see who you are, and I'm gonna go with that. Um, I always tell my kids, and I I was talking to Kessa about this with her, um some people she's talked to about dating, and I told her, like, when someone tells you shows you who they you they are, believe them. Same thing. Like, and if I forgive you and everything, but you've shown me who you are, and there is no repentance, there's no change. You're okay with the behavior, you think it's acceptable, you think it's okay. How can I reconcile with you? Right. How can we continue down this path? And how can we build a relationship deeper when I know mentally, spiritually, emotionally, you're not on the level that you need to be on. And I personally, I don't want to say don't have the patience because I have a lot of patience. I don't have the desire to play in the sandbox with you. Like I don't want to do that. So I we can be cordial, I I can love you at a distance, but we're not gonna be buddies. Sure. Because iron is not sharper sharpening iron here. That's not what's happening. You're doling me, right? And I don't want to be there, right?

SPEAKER_00 17:27

And and I think the thing is, is like you'll you'll find two different types of people. One will be very hyper grace, right? Which is what we've been talking about, and then you'll have one that's very cut them off, we're done, like they're dead to me, kind of never existing. Yeah, and I think that's wrong too, right?

SPEAKER_01 17:48

Oh, that's definitely wrong.

SPEAKER_00 17:49

I think that we have to give people an opportunity to show us something differently. But in giving them that opportunity, it doesn't mean that you also give them full access.

SPEAKER_01 18:02

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:03

You can always be open to someone rising to the occasion and showing you, you know, and I'm talking about like after repeated offenses, not just one thing, this is the first time we've ever, just forgive them and move on, right? But if someone has shown you a pattern of doing certain things, it is okay to both forgive them and be open to reconciliation at some point. Like, show me. Right. You know, because we would just be irresponsible to continue to give people unfettered access to us all the time, knowing what we know. So you can give opportunity for reconciliation and and have the grace to allow them to grow without putting your heart and everything else on the chopping block to do so. I I think that there it doesn't have to be one or the other. I think that you can do both, but you need to have wisdom in how you do it. There are certain certain circumstances when you cross the line, I know that there's we can never go back to how we used to be because of whatever the thing was. Right. But there are other things where it's just like, maybe I know that you're struggling in a like you're struggling in this season of your life for whatever reason. And it's causing you to do something that is typically out of character. I can have grace for the fact that I know you're like you lost someone. Let's say someone died and you're really struggling with that. And because of that, it's causing you to do things that you wouldn't normally do. I can still protect myself by not allowing you to stomp on my heart because you're treating me a particular way, but understand also at the same time that you're going through this thing right now that is causing you to act this way. So I'm leaving the door open. I'm leaving the door open to reconciliation. And when you are ready, come find me. Come find me. I'm not going to pull you here. You're not ready. You're dealing with all the things that you're dealing with. So the door is open, but I'm not forcing you to walk through it. And I think sometimes we don't do that. I think it's one or the other. I think it's either forgiveness immediate and and and reinstalling this person to this to that position, whether it's a friend or it's a job position or whatever it is, or we're completely cut off, get out of my life. I I I really don't like to be the you're completely cut off, get out of my life kind of person. I just that's just not my heart. But I will set a boundary until you show me something different if I have to.

SPEAKER_01 20:41

I think that when you're talking about people being able to forgive and reconcile and whatnot, and people going through things in life, that please let's not act like we've never been that person.

SPEAKER_00 20:55

Right.

SPEAKER_01 20:55

Yeah, let's not act like we've never been given grace when we absolutely did not deserve it. Everybody has things they walk through. Everybody has moments. I've had I've had moments where I've even had moments at work. I'm usually really good about it, but I've had moments where someone says something to me and I absolutely snapped at them. And then after the fact I said, you know, I just did everything I've taught you not to do. Let me go and apologize. Let me go and let them know, hey, I could have approached that a completely different way. Um I think that before we think that someone is beneath us to try to fix it, beneath us to forgive or beneath us to go forward, maybe just take a second to take a gander in the mirror and say, is that me? Like, am I the person that is doing have I done this before? Like they're going, what are they going through in life? They're human, just like I'm human. Like we're all supposed to be Christians, but life does happen.

SPEAKER_00 21:55

Right.

SPEAKER_01 21:56

And people handle things at different levels. They really do, right? Not everyone can handle it. Everything at the same. So do you take a second and say, okay, I'm giving them grace, one, because I love them, but I also know what they're going through. So I do think that this is mendable. I think that we can fix this. I do think he or she needs some some moments, some time, and then we'll fix it from there. I think that for me, I'm so the opposite. I'm the we're gonna fix this immediately. And I want you to know where, like, the reason I'm like that is just because jobs that I've had, I'm usually the person that I'm going to come to you to correct you. That's what I have to do. I have to correct you, I have to hold you accountable, I have to put pressure. These are things that I do. And so when I come in and I see you the next day, you're probably not gonna want to talk to me. You're gonna be over in the corner, you're gonna be avoiding me, no eye contact, you know, whatever it be may be. And I make it a point. Oh, we're gonna fix this right now. I'm gonna go sit down with this person, I'm gonna have a talk with them. I can see they're avoiding me. I can see that they're not, they're still having some feelings about this. Let me go and make this less awkward for them because it ain't awkward for me. So even in my life, when things happen, I'm the same way. Like, nah, let's go fix this.

SPEAKER_00 23:16

And see, for me, it depends. It depends on the situation because I am very much a I will give you your space kind of person. You get no space with me.

SPEAKER_01 23:26

So that's why Juliet will never have the opportunity.

SPEAKER_00 23:29

No, but calling her on the phone.

SPEAKER_01 23:31

What's going on? What's wrong with it?

SPEAKER_00 23:32

I'm not gonna give you space when I know that a conversation will fix the problem.

SPEAKER_01 23:37

Right.

SPEAKER_00 23:38

I'm not gonna allow for there to be opportunity for things to go unsaid to the point that nothing can be said now to fix it, like or can be done to fix it. I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna allow that, but I know me. And sometimes when I'm mad, doesn't happen a lot, but sometimes when I'm mad, I need you to leave me alone for a second. Because I gotta process through how I feel. And when I say process through how I feel, I don't just mean identifying the fact that I'm mad. I mean, am I mad for a justifiable reason? Like, these are the conversations I'm having in my mind. Okay, I know that I'm mad. Am I right? Is this something worth dying over? Killing a relationship over? If I give myself three days, will I be okay? Like, those kinds of things are the things I'm asking myself about me before I even get to the person I'm asking about me. Am I good or what's the date? Like all these questions that I'm asking myself, because I need to know. I'm just a processor. You know this, I overthink. But because I do that, when I get to have that conversation, I can have it level-headed.

SPEAKER_01 25:00

Right.

SPEAKER_00 25:00

Because I've had a chance to process. So since I'm like that, I know that I'm not the only one in the world who's like that. I have a tendency to give people space for a time.

SPEAKER_01 25:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:10

But what we're not gonna do is make this be six months down the road.

SPEAKER_01 25:14

And you're str you're stringing along and holding on to it, and then eventually something little happens and you blow the heck up because something tiny, because you were holding on to something that you should have been just talking it through.

SPEAKER_00 25:26

Exactly. Or someone that I love very much that has been a constant in my life is no longer in my life because what? We won't talk to each other. That's craziness to me. So, like, I I'll give you your space. Um, I need mine. Like, I like it when people respect the fact that like I just need a second.

SPEAKER_01 25:46

I can't. I won't give you your space.

SPEAKER_00 25:49

Well, we've not crossed that bridge yet, I don't think. So guess we'll find out. Stay tuned.

SPEAKER_01 25:56

Like right now.

SPEAKER_00 25:58

She'll be trying to fix it and I'll be trying to hide.

SPEAKER_01 26:00

I'll be like, Julia, what are you doing? Julia's not here.

SPEAKER_00 26:05

Please leave a message after the beat.

SPEAKER_01 26:07

I'll be like, listen, we gotta fix this right now because there is no reason we should be doing this. I think my problem is if I don't do it, then I won't do it because tomorrow I'll wake up and I'll be like, eh.

SPEAKER_00 26:20

And see, that's what you have me for. Because tomorrow you'll be over it, and then tomorrow I'll be in a place to talk, so I'll bring it up.

SPEAKER_01 26:27

And see, and she knows because I'm sure she's seen me do it multiple times where I'm really, I'm really passionate. I'm like, okay, we need to get this, this, this, not anger, just like very like like I and I'll have I'll have good stuff to say. Like, it's good. And then 24 hours will pass, and I'm like, eh, whatever.

SPEAKER_00 26:44

Yeah, and she's really hot or cold. She's not lukewarm on this particular subject because it'll be Tuesday, and I'll talk to her about it, and she's like, yeah, this is what we're gonna do. And then Wednesday comes along and she's like, I don't really feel that way anymore. I'm just like, girl, I was ready to charge into battle with you. Now what? I guess we've got to go to dinner or something. We ain't got nothing else to do.

SPEAKER_01 27:12

I don't even know. I don't even know what we were even gonna talk about at this point. I've done by by this point, I've I've put the kids to bed, I've made dinner, I've dealt with my teenagers' attitudes, I've done work, and now we're here. I'm not even concerned about this.

SPEAKER_00 27:27

Me, on the other hand, I ain't got no kids or teenage attitudes to deal with, so I've had time to process. Yeah, I don't even look at it from all ages.

SPEAKER_01 27:35

I process really well in the moment, and then once the moment's gone, I'm like, eh, whatever.

SPEAKER_00 27:42

But either way, whether you are a processor or not, we should all be quick to forgive.

SPEAKER_01 27:49

That's right. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 27:50

That is a precedence that I think God showed. And we become more like him when we forgive like him, because none of us deserves forgiveness or grace from God, who is perfect. He don't ever mess this thing up. So anytime it goes south, it's us, but he forgives us. He calls us to be like him by doing that for other people. So we should be quick to forgive, but I think we should be discerning on whether to or how quickly to reconcile. I'm not saying it should be off the table. Definitely not saying it should be off the table. But make sure that the outcome of said reconciliation is gonna be good and not disastrous.

SPEAKER_01 28:35

Yeah, yeah. Make sure that you're not not reconciling because of pride. Right. And because that's if you can reconcile, if you can, you should. If you can, why not? Yeah, of course. If you like I know there's a ton of people in the world, but there's not a lot of people that you can go deep with and you can build these relationships with. And the only way you get deep and you get in relationships is when an offense happens, when something that happens that you need to forgive, is that you do reconcile and you continue to dig deeper. Like it it would be dumb to say that I'm never going to make you mad. Right. I'm never gonna say something out of pocket that's gonna hurt your feelings.

SPEAKER_00 29:17

And if you know this, it's probably gonna happen.

SPEAKER_01 29:19

Right. That you know, I I'm never gonna make you mad. Like it's it'd be dumb to say that in the first time I make you mad, or when I make you mad, if your response is, I forgive her, but I think I'm gonna need to distance. I think I'm gonna need to make space. I'm not ready to reconcile. I don't wanna we're not gonna be where we were right now. Well, we're not gonna get very far if we keep playing the like two steps up, two steps back, two steps up, three steps up. You know what I mean? It's not gonna work. So if you can reconcile and it's possible, and you see the growth in the person, you know their heart, um you should. Because if you're not, if they they they've asked you to forgive them, you've seen growth, you see that they're being genuine, and you still choose not to reconcile, you might have some pride issues.

SPEAKER_00 30:08

Yeah, yeah. And last time I checked, that cometh before the fall. So you might want to cometh before the fall. That's the King James version. You might want to get that figured out um very quickly because that then becomes a me problem and not a them problem.

SPEAKER_01 30:27

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 30:28

And if we're checking hearts, Zimeth problem.

SPEAKER_01 30:31

Is that the King James version?

SPEAKER_00 30:32

Zimmeth is crazy. Um, I hope it's in there. I'm gonna go find it now and see if I can find them. I'm gonna start texting you like that.

SPEAKER_01 30:40

So funny story. Um, whenever Michael was getting his, I don't want to say it was his first Bible ever, but it was his first Bible since like, I don't know, like me and him had got back together, he got in church, he ordered a Bible, he's all excited, and he brings this Bible over to me. And I look at it, I said, Michael, why did you buy this Bible? He's like, What do you mean? I said, It's the King James version. He said, It's the best version. I said, It's like reading Shakespeare. Like, why would you pick this? He's like, Nah, it's gonna be good. And I don't know, maybe a week later, Amazon dropped off a package, open it up. What I don't know, the what English standard NIV, uh new ESV. Is it ES? No, it's NIV, I think is what he has. The new international version. Is that what it is?

SPEAKER_00 31:31

Sure. I don't know. Anyways, just thought when you said it was too too many thines and thou's in there for him.

SPEAKER_01 31:38

I guess so.

SPEAKER_00 31:39

I get that.

SPEAKER_01 31:40

I looked at that, I didn't even open it. I just looked at it and said, why would you buy the King James version? That's very interesting. Like, I feel like I'm not advanced enough to be reading the King James version yet, okay?

SPEAKER_00 31:49

No, I need regular English, please.

SPEAKER_01 31:51

So at some point, maybe we'll be there. The thighs and thous.

SPEAKER_00 31:55

Nah, there's just certain things that stick, like cometh. That just that that sticks, you know. But but some of the other stuff, I I don't know what y'all talking about. Please give me a dumber translation because I can't can't with that one.

SPEAKER_01 32:10

I cannot. No, that just made me think of that.

SPEAKER_00 32:12

No, that's good. But yeah, um, be quick to forgive.

SPEAKER_01 32:16

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 32:17

Use your brain and more importantly, your spirit, to discern reconciliation, but be open to it.

SPEAKER_01 32:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 32:25

I think that's the takeaway.

SPEAKER_01 32:26

We're all we all suck.

SPEAKER_00 32:29

At some point. Yes, we did. Okay, okay. Okay. Let's get off of this before I have to repeat. Okay. Okay.